Danny commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Which happens to be a perfect explanation for the difference in success levels for high speed rail systems. All successful high speed rail systems were capacity expansions for crowded low speed rail...
View ArticleLouis commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Right. Another point is that things like express trains (in NYC, in particular) were not made to get people to their destinations more quickly. They were simply made to move more people, i.e. increase...
View ArticleDavid in Ottawa commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Then we can all agree that Ottawa's Transitway is the result of high transit ridership in Ottawa rather than the other way around like the entire BRT promotion industry wants everyone to believe....
View ArticleEngineerScotty commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Honestly, this isn't an either-or, folks. It's likely some of both. Many transit advocates readily accept the theory of induced demand ("if you build it, they will come") when it comes to freeway...
View ArticleMichael D. Setty commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
The dataset presented is missing two key things: total service area for each operator, and some indication of service level. Overall, the calculated million riders per 100,000 (another way of stating...
View ArticleDoug Allen commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
The Aug. 2010 issue of "Tramways & Urban Transit" has a short piece on the Cologne rail and tram system. To quote the article, after World War II, "...a policy not only to persist with tramways but...
View ArticleTransitPlannerMunich commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice...
The unknown planner from Munich compiling this data about passengers in cities with or without a tram system is me. Indeed the "disease" to build trams to attract more riders is widely spread in...
View ArticleJarrett at HumanTransit.org commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership?...
@TransitPlanner Thanks for the additiaional thoughts on this! I certainly wouldn't use the term "disease." If converting buses to trams without making other mobility improvements increases ridership...
View ArticleDoug Allen commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Correlation can still be a good tool for unearthing possible mechanisms of causation. I would agree with "TransitPlannerMunich" that experience with the conversion of a bus route to tram, in a city...
View ArticleDavid in Ottawa commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Canada should offer up data on the bus-to-rail issue in two cities this decade: Calgary and Ottawa. Calgary's West LRT project ( http://westlrt.ca ) currently under construction will replace a "themed"...
View ArticleEngineerScotty commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Doug, How does the Yellow compare with the old 5/Interstate in terms of the other performance parameters--speed and reliability? While the Yellow is kinda slow for a train with exclusive ROW, it does...
View ArticleTransitPlannerMunich commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice...
Jarret, you picked the tram network map of Munich and complained about the bus lines that are missing there. Well, the buses are missing there because it is a tram network map. The buses are part of...
View ArticleBrisben commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
It should be easy to test this hypothesis. Shut down a tram line for 3-6 months and replace it with buses at identical frequency running along the same alignment. Does the patronage stay the same,...
View ArticleNwali commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Interesting read. Thanks for sharing the info.
View ArticleBradley Wentworth commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Some reasons for the correlation may be subtler. I think it was Steve Munro who pointed out on his blog that riding the rails is simply more comfortable: the acceleration profile of...
View ArticleTom West commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
Danny: All failing [high-speed rail] systems were constructed under the impression that speed causes ridership. I disagree. When users have to choose between two competeing modes, travel time is...
View ArticleDoug Allen commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
@Scotty: Portland's former line 5 was definitely affected by traffic due to the portion on I-5 to Vancouver, Washington, so agreed, the Yellow Line isn't a perfectly controlled experiment. This fall,...
View Articlesamussas commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
@Danny: What are the failing high-speed rail system? I've never heard of one. Even the Taiwan HSR is getting better and its failure was mostly due to design errors and debt servicing. And speed caused...
View ArticleJohn commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
I have the same question as samussas regarding possible network structure changes when a tram or light rail line is introduced. I'm pretty sure Portland changed the bus system to feed the yellow line...
View ArticleEngineerScotty commented on 'munich: do trams cause ridership? vice versa?'
I've written a DHT article which expands on this one. (And I must confess to being even more verbose than Jarrett...)
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